C-210 AIrspeeds for landing

C-210 AIrspeeds for landing

I'm a recent proud papa of a  71'C-210K and searching for experienced pilot infor of this model. It has an I/O 520 engine. Love the plane and look foward to many years of flying it.
The POH doesn't provide much help on approach speeds for "normal" and "short field" landings (as far as final and over the fence numbers). I quickly learned that if I don't hold it off and bleed of the airspeed to land it will it won't spay put. I obviously don't want to stall it over the numbers and am very concerned about a short field landing with to much speed. 
I have about 25 hours in the plane and about 25 landings (was pacticing various down wind/base/final/over the fence/landing speeds).
It appears (based on the three best glide speeds listed in the POH) that since this is a heavy hauler) that there may be varying airspeeds as well for the approach and over the fence number speeds. Is this true and what advise can you offer.
Here's what I worked up for a normal landing based on the stall speeds, the POH, and about 20 practice landings.

DOWN WIND: Trim the plane for 100 mph @ 17" M/P (level flight)
AT THE NOMBERS: cut the M/P to 14", 10 deg flaps, and pitch and trim for 95 mph, establish a 500fpm decent.
TURNING BASE: 20 deg flaps, pitch for 90 mph and maintain a 500fpm decent.
TURNING FINAL: 30 deg flaps, pitch for 85 mph and maintain a 500fpm decent.
FINAL APPROACH: pitch for 85 mph and power for runway
over the fence: pitch for 80 mph and power for runway
LANDING: flare and hold (nose high, with very little power) about 3 feet above the runway, hold to bleed airspeed until the plane settles on the mains, then cut the power, retract the flaps and ease in the brakes(while holding back on the yoke).

Tom Lyon
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Re: C-210 AIrspeeds for landing

Tom, I do not know if I can address your question about the 210 but I have a 182 and had the same concern about being too fast and having to be patient to bleed off airspeed so as to not be too slow on short final.  When I first bought my plane It seemed as if I were always very fast on landing and taking up a lot of runway.  However after I studied the POH I discovered that I have a huge difference in CAS and IAS with flaps down.  All speeds in my POH are CAS.  For example the POH indicates that the stall speed for 0 degrees bank and full flaps is 57 mph CAS.  The airspeed correction table shows that 57 mph CAS is equal to 40 mph IAS.  I practiced some stalls to confirm this great difference  between CAS and IAS and was amazed to confirm it.  I then practiced landings using this knowledge and what a difference it made.  I now target 65 mph IAS on final and start slowing further as I near the runway.  At 65 mph IAS I am actually flying about 70 mph.  Before I realized this and setting up at a 70 mph approach speed I was actually flying at 80 mph CAS.

Like I said this made a remarkable improvement in my landings and more confidence with short field landings.

Brian Taylor
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Re: C-210 AIrspeeds for landing

I own a 1970 C210K (airspeeds are in mph) and have been flying it for more than half a decade, mostly with my whole family (of six) near maximum gross weight in hot weather.

Your speeds and flap settings look about right, except turning final.  Don't put full flaps in while you are still on base.  I try to keep it above 90mph turning final, maybe closer to 100mph.  Once you banish from your mind the airline-infused mantra of a "stabilized approach" you will begin to have better landings.  After you turn final, you crank in full flaps (I use full flaps 95% of the time, even with crosswinds), and then gradually bleed off airspeed all the way to the flare.  It takes some skill not to bleed off too much airspeed too soon, and you are now complicating your landings by adding an extra dimension (a changing speed on final, as well as a descending altitude and lateral dimensions to worry about), so don't do this if you are not confident.  The most deceleration happens in the last 200 feet or so, which means for most of the final approach you are actually flying faster than typical---you are not hanging out there on final for a long time, you are getting on down, and then only slowing down a lot in the last 200 feet.  With that in mind (slowing down in the last 200 feet) I generally chop the power completely in the last 200 feet, and let the airspeed bleed off.  Fly over the fence near the bottom of the green arc (75 to 80, assuming no gusts or crosswinds) and then let airpseed continue to bleed off as you flare.  Flare a foot or two off the runway, with the yoke all the way in your lap, and let it settle.  If you touch down before the yoke is in your lap, and tap the brakes while the wings are generating lift, you will put a bald spot on your tires, and maybe get an instant flat tire (especially in an empty airplane).  So get used to pulling the yoke all the way back into your lap, every time.  I fly crosswind landings the same way, except I don't pull out the throttle all the way in the last 200 feet--I keep a little throttle in as I flare (because the slip really slows you down, with full flaps).  A little throttle also allows you to get airborne again if a crosswind gust messes up your flare.

This airplane is easier to land with a full load and aft CG, but be careful on takeoff not to get too nose high too soon with an aft CG.  Keep the nose down on takeoff to gain enough airspeed to be stable, if you are at max gross weight and full aft CG.

Cessnas are "not approved for slips" but what do you do every time you fly a crosswind landing?  A slip.  What's with that?  So if you have full flaps and and you are way above the glidepath on final, and at the top of the white arc, what do you do?  If you shove the yoke in to keep the airpspeed toward the top of the white arc as you aggressively slip to lose some altitude, do you think it will stall or spin?  Your flight instructor always told you not to dive the airplane to lose altitude, but do think maybe that only applies to the last 200 feet of the approach, and not when you are in a slip?  I'm not suggesting anything, just asking a few questions . . . But be sure to warn your passengers if you are going to do an aggressive slip, because it will stand their hair on end.

I don't worry about being fast and high at the beginning of final approach, so long as it is gradually slowing down to an acceptable speed by the time I clear the fence.  I think starting the final approach fast and high also gives you a little more gliding options if there is an engine failure, as opposed to a stabilized approach where you drag it in slowly all the way down the glide path.  Starting the approach fast and high, decelerating all the way down, also gets you in the habit of a tight pattern, which in my opinion is safer than dragging it in on a "stablized approach" for many miles on final.  But, keep in mind that by "fast" I mean toward the top of the white arc--you do have to plan your descent far enough in advance to be that slow by final.

Wes Schlenker
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